Miles non-tendered

Aaron Miles has been non-tendered. Story to follow on the site.
-M.

58 Comments

But I want to know now…. I Miles has been one of my top 5 Cardinals snice he’s been here.

I’ll miss the little guy, but they made the right decision. Here’s hoping he catches on with someone else.

Do you really think Jarett Hoffpauir will be considered for a utility role? I was kinda hoping that if Adam Kennedy couldn’t come back from his bad year last year, he would get the first crack at the starting second baseman job instead of bringing in somebody else. It seems like the Cards biggest problem is their lack of home grown talent and a future infield of Hoffpauir and Ryan might not only be a cheaper idea, but a good one to if they play to the best of their potential.

Miles is not an answer for a struggling offense or defense, he played hard but I won’t miss him. We need offense somewhere and have too much depth in our middle infield to waste a roster spot on him.

I understand these are the correct decisions, but they hurt, regardless. Really gonna miss Miles. I really hated the guy in ’06, which made him like a big inside joke between me and my gal… We ended up lovin’ the guy because we ragged on him so much.

Sigh. The Cardinals are starting to look pretty faceless at the moment. I can’t really think of anybody that I like for their personality on the team now, with Eck, So, and Miles gone. Again, personality doesn’t win ball games, etcetera, but it sure makes a difference as a fan.

Sure, it hurts me some too, losing So, Eck, Bennett, Miles…I thought Miles might be in line to remain as a backup, but then there tends to always be younger players coming along good enough to be backups.

Yes, when you struggle you know it’s time to make changes. Where do the Cards go from here? The Cubs and Astros have been making big deals.

The Cardinals amaze me with their management ineptness.

They refused to go after Alfonso Soriano, a quality outfielder.

They non tendered their NLCSMVP pitcher last year; this from a team that DESPERATELY needs pitching, instead going to the scrap heap for guys like Kip Wells. How’s that work out?

They non tendered their World series MVP from 2005, Eckstein.

Instead, they re-sign an over the hill center fielder that they got for a bargain basement price (Edmonds).

They managed to pick a fight with their seven time gold glove 3d basemnan.

The manager, goes public with in house squabbles, which does no one any good.

LaRussa, Dincan, the ownership hjave done nothing to improve a club that has slipped mightedly, while Milwaukee, Chicago and Houston have improved themselves. This is a case of Florida Marlins all over..

In the long run, the attendance and fan support will suffer. Put a lousy product on the field and it will come back to haunt you.

Oh yeah, the only move the birds made so far is to acquire some non descript catcher. Way to go boys

bummer…i loved Miles…and I can still remember several clutch hits in late innings he delivered (especially in Houston). Played hard, understood his role, etc., but I understand the move.

Biggest disappointment, though…my son got his autograph…he’ll be sad…bummer…

Man, this winter has already been horrible first of all we cant seem to spend money on pitching, we get rid of class guys on the team Miles and So have been there with the Cards preforming the duties of reserves with a classy love for the game. When we are unloading players how about getting rid of guys that are always hurt or cant control their personal life making it affect the team. This is the reason I long for the old days when players, and management had loyalty to the teams they play for and we knew who was going to play each year its just a shame that business is all about dollars and not about the fans.

Whoa!!!

dmarcus,

While I understand and mostly agree with your points in general, I don’t think they apply here.

I love Miles, but we just had a plethora of infielders and utitility infielders on the team. Miles was not the future (as Ryan may be), he was not the best defensively (as Izturis may be), and he was not a potential leadoff/starter (like Kennedy is when he’s right). The man was just a player without a position. It stinks, but we had to drop someone and the others just don’t make sense to drop.

I don’t think you can say it’s not about the fans in THIS situation. Making the team better IS about the fans. If we weren’t concerned about the fans and only about profit margins…well…we would be the Royals (although, they are looking like they are heading in the right direction).

By the way, in regards to Mo letting fan favorites go…

This reminds me of some advice a writing professor once gave us – “Kill your darlings.”

It refers to a writer’s hesitancy to cut out portions of a novel or story that just don’t need to be there and weaken the overall story. They may be portions the author particularly loves and HATES to part with, but to make the overall story a success, he/she MUST cut it. He/she MUST “kill his/her darlings.”

That’s what Mo is doing…we have fan favorites, but we don’t have a good, solid team for the future. So, Miles, Bennett, etc….fan favorites, yes…but not the best options for the future of this team. Mo understands that, and he’s willing to step up and make the tough decisions in order to make this a better team.

That’s a good GM right there, fella’s. You think he doesn’t know we are all going to moan and groan about letting So and Miles go? He knows. And, the “saving money” point holds no water, either…he’s letting our cheapest players go knowing that we may (most likely will) pay more for better players to replace them in the future.

Therefore, if he knows it’s going to upset fans, and it can’t be about money, then it must be with the intent to truly better the team.

Again…patience and tough decisions. Way to go, Mo.

That’s a real shame. He’s been a fine backup infielder and could be had for a song, I’m assuming. Unless I’m missing something or there’s an infielder deal in the making, I see this as a blunder.

Man, I just couldn’t disagree with some of y’all more.

Miles is a good guy, and he got his uniform dirty. There’s a fan appeal there, especialyl for kids. OK.

Besides that…

He wasn’t going to be cheap. He made an even $1MM last year, and given that his superficial numbers were better, and he has another year of service time, he was going to get a raise.

And for what? No OBP, no power, and not a particularly good defensive player.

There’s no way the Cardinals aren’t a better team going with other options, like Ryan and hopefully Hoffpauir.

This was, to my eye, one of the most indisputably good decisions they’ve made thus far this winter, along with taking Barton in the Rule 5.

-M.

I agree, Matt. We have to be careful not to confuse fan appeal for best option on the field or the check book.

i have to say – as devil’s advocate – if Rasmus struggles in the bigs, we’re all going to look a little silly.

how much of a sure thing is he, Matt? this is probably a good mailbag question, but is there solid evidence across MLB showing guys with great minors numbers put up great majors numbers?

Yes.

If you’re THAT good, THAT young, in the high Minors, you’re pretty much as safe a bet as anybody. I mean, yeah, a small number of those guys flame out — but a small number of established big leaguers flame out too. But it’s long since established that there is no better predictor of Major League performance than Minor League performance. And when that includes an across-the-board skill set, and performance at a VERY young age in the high Minors, that’s as close to sure as you’re going to get.

-M.

great. that’s good news. i’m excited for him to get called up, and i hope i get to see him play in person someday.
Thanks, Matt

Matt…are you at the press conference right now on the Mitchell report?

sorry…don’t know where to post to ask you…really curious about “a day in the life” of your job and such.

Nope, we have several reporters there but I’m in STL today, covering specifically any Cardinals-related angles.

-M.

cool…thanks for answering, Matt.

The way I see things thus far. So Taguchi was getting old and losing some ability, sure he was great, but didn’t we get Barton to replace him? If I remember correctly, Barton is a pretty darn good player. David Eckstein was 33 and I do believe he wanted a 4 year 36 million dollar contract, isn’t that right? Bringing up Miles, he was a decent hitter, when it came to average, but he was lousy at defense and had no power at all. Looking at LaRue, yes he can’t hit, but he adds something we’ve been needing from a back up catcher, the ability to throw base runners out. Think of it this way, we got Molina and only a crazy person would run on him, and now we got LaRue, who’s also good at throwing people out, that means other teams won’t run on us as much. And Izturis is a great defensive short stop who adds a bit of speed to the team and is a great 1 year replacement. Think of it this way, we may not be the best team in 2008, but at least we’ll have a bit more moeny to spend in 2009 to improve the team. Stop looking forward to 2008 and instead look towards the future. In 2009, we’re supposed to be having Rasmus, hopefully as an everyday starter, we might have Chris Perez, lets hope. I see it this way. Why try and spend a lot of money this year, when we don’t have a lot of money to spend.

I heard from someone in a group that I’m in on MySpace that Albert Pujols was listed as one of the names on the Mitchel Report. Does anyone know if this is true or not? I hope it’s not, that’s why I’m wondering.

I did not see Albert’s name mentioned in the press regarding the Mitchell report.
Ankiel is mentioned.

Saw a report that Toronto was close to signing Eckstein for one year for appx. $4.5 mil.

I still have a hard time figuring out why the Cards

couldn’t have worked out a similar deal.

Pujols is not in the report. Nothing we didn’t already know about Ank is in there.

Go to MLB.com and get a pdf copy of the report and use the search function from the file menu to search the document for keywords…like “Cardinals”…quick way to get the specific info you’re looking for…

Pujols was rumored before the report came out, but he is not in there.

From what I’ve heard jdun, he’s already a member of Toronto, and another thing is the Cardinals weren’t willing to offer him what he was asking.

Miles was fairly decent as a Card, but now you’ve got to wonder where they’re headed next.

I’m not liking the looks of the 2008 Cardinals. You don’t sign your World Series MVP and sign Cesar Izturis. You cut your 2nd baseman in hopes of Kennedy doing well (and, just how DID he do last year?).

You need a lot of things, pitching mainly, and our new GM is following Jocketty’s footsteps. He’s getting everyone’s scrubs that no one wants in hopes that they’ll be good for us. That has GOT to change, especially if we want a playoff-caliber team. NOW.

Cezar Izturis is a temporary 1 year replacement, have you ever stopped to think that the Cardinals aren’t looking at 2008, but rather looking forward to 2009? We won a World Series in 2006, just wait, you got to be patient man.

What about Adam Everett? Why couldn’t we land him.He would have been a good replacement for Eck and he signed a one year deal today.

Crazy–as a librarian, I can’t recommend MySpace as a source of information. I prefer Wikipedia. ;-)

–Mrs. Dude, kidding. But not about the librarian part. Or the Wikipedia part.

I don’t know, there are some smart people on there…-cracks up laughing- So how do you do Mrs. Dude?

*********, Albert. You’re not in my Top 8 anymore!!!

any thoughts on the conspiracy theory that albert’s name was on the report, as leaked by cnbc, and that it was removed by major league baseball, as were other prominent players, varitek for example. Some people suspect that these names were removed because these are current star players and if they were dragged through the mud it would reflect poorly on mlb

thats the dumbest thing i’ve ever heard…don’t you think they would’ve deleted ROGER CLEMENS name out of the report if they were going to delete anyone? seriously he is probably a top 10 pitcher, all-time.

EARuttle, librarians rule (I married a really sporty, and even more committed Cardinals fan than me)!!!!

All I know w/r/t Mitchell is that they turned people in NY, borrowed from an investigation in the Bay Area, couldn’t get direct information on practices elsewhere and the commish only mentions punishing players (e.g., no discipline for management or ownership). The names on the list, accurate or otherwise, is irresponsibly partial and deeply suspicious… why would Radumsky (spel?) have uncashed or photocopied checks from players like Vina unless he was planning on ratting them out or blackmailing them? I can’t stand Roger Clemens (and don’t like Pettitte) and am happy to believe he was a user (and have assumed as much for quite some time) but the claims against him were obviously made under duress which raise real issues about their legitimacy.

Steroids and HGH have been a problem and need to be eliminated but this whole process is too partial to generate anything other than unbalanced punishment… at least to my way of thinking.

There is no way that ANYONE would have been removed from this report, that would just defeat the entire purpose of the report.

heymatto70, my concern is that the entire purpose of this report is either problematic or uncertain — it’s obviously nowhere near comprehensive (did they interview any of the folks who were GMs between 1988 and 2002 about what they knew or suspected and when and/or come up with a plan for disciplining management who knew [and implicitly, therefore, encouraged this whole thing] and did nothing?) and is something that is going to (in/appropriately?) tar some PED takers but not the majority of them much less all of them.

Kruk is right, naming names under the staggeringly partial background conditions of this report suggests that the purpose is to generate contingently-derived punishment of selective players in the name of saving Selig’s legacy far more than it is about anything else.

Or at least that’s how it looks from here.

Oh I agree, this report does nothing and show us nothing that we didnt already know. No proof no subpoena power, nothing done under oath, all is a joke.

Look…

Let’s not be ridiculous here, people. We’re not conspiracy theorists, we’re baseball fans. If we weren’t being so cynical…there IS at least one possible explanation for the lack of comprehensive disclosure in this report: They actually told the truth!

Think about it…we’ve all known that no one in their right mind was going to talk to George Mitchell and their investigators. Therefore, we knew the information was going to be nowhere near comprehensive…and if you thought it was going to be, then that’s a You problem (I love saying that). In fact, most of the things I am hearing from reporters is their surprise that we have as much detail as we do in the report.

The information they obtained and disclosed in the report was all taken from a few sources for a reason…they are the only sources they could compel to talk to them through fear of prosecution. And as far as naming names…it’s the only way to lend any kind of credability to the report. Think about it…

If we got a report from an almost 2-year investigation that said “Player 1 referred Player 2 to Mr. McNamee for the purpose of obtaining additional steroids for Players 3 and 4 and a possible Player 5 to be named later…” the report would have lost all credability. Everyone would sit back and say “Eh…what do we really know? Nothing. We know there was stuff going on…big deal. We knew that…without names and organizations and officials, there is no way to track down the structure and evolution of the so-called ‘steroids era.’”

Also, you include names to demonstrate just how much of a problem the issue was in the past and continues to be in the present. To me, the big names are not as condemning as the small names…if Gary Bennett can be tainted, then ANYONE can be tainted. It’s guys like that that represent the guys that are barely holding onto roster spots and are looking for that edge to help stay there.

There just is no adequate motivation to remove names in some grand conspiracy. Don’t fool yourself…the game will be fine. Everyone loved Mark McGwire…but guess what…when his reputation fell, the game did NOT go with it. Despite how people want to say MLB is playing Spin Doctor, the numbers don’t lie…baseball stadiums are packed RIGHT SMACK DAB IN THE MIDDLE of the steroids controversey. If a Pujols or an A-Rod or whatever had been on the report, baseball would hurt, but it could’ve handled it.

Finally, regarding names vs. no names in the report, if he had not included names in the report, we would simply be overwhelmed by false lists – as we were prior to the release of the report. Sure, MLB could have released an altered list to “appease the masses” from creating more lists, but it just doesn’t make sense. We were already prepared, in a way, for our biggest names to be on the report – the risk of compromising the integrity of the report simply makes it too dangerous to alter it at all. Imagine if they did alter it and it came out later – instead of putting steroids era talk behind us – BAM – whole new stain on the sport. I just don’t see it.

Last point (sorry this is so long)…Jose Canseco…I heard on TV last night that he is shocked that A-Rod’s not on the list. Come on, people!! Canseco is one step shy of being a full-blown narcissist. If there’s one person in this world that does NOT want the steroids issue to go away, it’s Canseco. It’s all he has to hold onto and the source of his claim to fame and attention. And…don’t forget…anyone, and I mean anyone, who is held aloft as a better homerun hitter than he was is automatically a target of Jose Canseco…he just has to wrap his addled mind around a proper scheme for attacking them.

Thank you, Cardinal Nation…that is all… :)

As far as Canseco goes, I thought it was the funniest thing that he wasn’t allowed in the press conference. I couldn’t help but laugh at that.

Hey Kevin: I usually agree with you. On this one, not so much. My reaction to the report remains: “Eh…what do we really know? Nothing. We know there was stuff going on…big deal. We knew that…[EVEN WITH THESE] names and organizations and officials [I didn't see any of these], there is [still] no way to track down the structure and evolution of the so-called ‘steroids era.’” We don’t know anything about the structure or evolution of the era in Houston, Miami, Denver, Seattle, San Diego, Chicago, Boston, Atlanta, Minneapolis, Detroit or any of the other cities (including St Louis) – much less any of the minor league cities – where this stuff was certainly as prevalent as it was in NY and the Bay Area.

I don’t believe there was a conspiracy and I don’t believe a report – which the commish-owner seems to believe is actionable – is sufficiently legitimate to be of any serious utility in terms of understanding the era – especially (imagine that word italicized, made bold and underlined) given its completely expected utter lack of comprehensiveness. They have reports, effectively, from two urban metropoles among the 20+ in the majors and hundreds in the minors.

So, now the named record-setting, big or great names (and always remember there are no management or owners’ names) are going to be tarnished but the unnamed, important and great names (among players, management and owners) are effectively getting off completely scot free… sweet.

All of this, as you point out Kevin, was predictable… which is why Mitchell was put in an utterly untenable position and the report – however partially revealing it is – strikes me as equally untenable as an account of the era and the basis for beating up guys like Clemens (who, you should remember I viscerally can’t stand) but not [you fill in the blank].

Stay warm and away from ice in trees and black ice on the ground.

Ok ENOUGH enough about the report. It impacts the Cards very little. I am concerned with the plans for the team for 2008.

Ok, you guys can sure talk about what you want, but Matthew, we need to also talk about the Cards moves. Have they gone too far with changes? Is it really time to cut ties with so many decent, if unspectacular players? Tough questions.

On a team with so many many question marks for the upcoming season, I like Miles. He’s not exceptional by any stretch. But he’s a known quantity as a backup infielder. Let’s say we’d have to pay him $1.25 or even $1.5 M……it’s nothing in baseball money. How much more do we have to spend to get someone who’s substantially better? How much do we save by going with someone who gets paid the minimum? I don’t want another possible crapout like Kennedy in the infield. I’ll take a semi-guarantee of “above average” as my backup and save the money for the pipe dream of spending some money on pitching.

But in what area was Miles even average, never mind above average? It’s Brendan Ryan who basically takes his place, and at worst Ryan should match Miles’ OBP and SLG — at best, he could be a lot better. Plus, he’s faster and a better defender. Miles was a replacement-level hitter in each of his two years in STL. That’s the very definition of a guy you non-tender.

-M.

Some writers may not totally agree. One question is that Miles is a versatile switch hitter who could back up the new ss 2b combination, whoever it turns out to be.

I agree, that Ryan is bigger, stronger, and faster that Miles, or Eckstein for that matter. I wonder, can Izturis be enough of a hitter to start?

I guess it’s hard to argue that a team that struggled as the Cards did, that changes need to be relatively bold.

You’d be hard pressed to find a professional sports writer who would disagree with nt’ing Miles. He’s a 32 year old average (at best) infielder. I love the guy, but as stated, it’s the right call. Ryan is what, 8 or 9 years younger? More upside than Miles.

Jeff Gordon of the Post did raise some questions. I agree with you mostly. I wonder, who do you think will play 2B.

Kennedy will begin the season as the 2B. Ryan will be the fallback, with the possibility existing that Hoffpauir could impress.

-M.

Hoff seems to have good potential. Hopefully a healthy Adam has some left in the tank. A slightly calmed down Ryan could continue to establish himself.

So Matt, do you see any deals that are currently in the works with the Cards right now or is this roster the one that will be given on Opening Day?

Mo isn’t Walt. With Walt, the good thing was you might wake up on any given day to some fabulous wizardry of a trade. I don’t see that happening, between this being Mo’s first gig and the current torn asunder-trade market. I think we’re looking at the protein of our stir fry as is, fellas. Sure, we might throw in a carrot or a piece of pineapple, but it looks like this will be the bulk of our roster. I’d expect another lackluster starting pitcher signing and a Reyes trade, at most. No fault of Mo, that’s just the way it looks these days, unfortunately.

So what has the new gen. manager done for us Cards fans??? Hmmmm lets see. He’s gotten rid of Cards favorites….Jimmy and Eck and SOOOOO and Miles. Doesn’t sound like I’ll know anyone on the team in 08. What’s is going on with this??? I can’t wait to see Channel 5′s report with Eckstein tonight.

Who Cares! SOOOOO and Miles..38 years old and Full Time bench player..Jimmy???Went from Hall of Famer to Strikeout king in the past few years with major health questions, Eck health and defensive liablitiy…Are they all cards favorites? Yes, Did I like them all? Yes…Will I miss any of them? yes I will miss the people..will I miss their health/offensive/defensive woes? Not a chance…our team is, younger, healthier and better without them. If Mo gets some starting pitching somehow on this team we will be just fine, if not duplicate of last year.

If you are a future HoFer, you are one even after a bad year. Edmonds has had a brilliant career and is a possible HoFer.

I have never posted on this site before….strictly the Jays site. But many are posting negative things about the eckstien signing to Toronto. I thought maybe I would get your opinions on the matter since you know him best. Is Eck a vast improvment in general to the jays as everyday shortstop considering Johnny Mac was slated to be the everday shortstop? thanks

Offensively, he is a bit of an upgrade. Better contact and better speed. Defensively, you have a massive downgrade.

Eck plays hard… I’ve always appreciated that. The guy shouldn’t be playing ball, but he works so hard at it that he still contends. I see no downside to the deal. If healthy, he’s a decent leadoff guy that bats .300. On a cheap one year contract, I don’t see the problem.

I think it’s more to do with the Jays not making any real moves to contend in the division they’re in. Maybe that lack of a big deal’s frustration is being taken out solely on the signing of Eck?

In my opinion it’s hard to tell whether he’ll be “better” or “worse” on the field than Johnny Mac, but he’ll be “different” — totally different strengths and weaknesses. One thing for sure is that he’s fun to watch, and this is no small thing. I got the impression, admittedly based on just one visit to Rogers last year, that Jays fans are rather blase’ and the team lacks interesting characters. Eck is definitely interesting, and charismatic. If he puts fans in the seats, he’ll have value to the team beyond his stats. On balance you should be happy with this pickup, although not ecstatic.

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